Shops, Points, and Pretend Currency Systems

998930

Thanks,

This is something I don't want on scratch and really like this topic because,

1. People would brag about stuff it they had more points are currency then
other people which does not make sense.

2. There are some people who just wander into scratch at around 8 if this
happened then they would probably get some bad stuff going with their
parents and maybe get banned from scratch when they liked it

Again thanks for making the topic

sti_scratch

katixirro wrote:
I don’t think this is fair. People are allowed to tell other people what to do with their work, to a certain extent of course, but still… We should be allowed to decide whether other people can use our work, it is ours after all, not Scratch’s.

There should be a rule that you have to ask another Scratcher to use their work, even if you give credit, unless it is a remix.

EDIT: I am not saying this against remixes, just that it seems unfair that “you can sell stuff as long as it’s not real money, but anyone can use it even without paying as long as they credit you”. That’s basically saying, “This shop can sell stuff, but people are allowed to steal from it as long as they say it was from that shop”. Do you get me?

All content published on Scratch is under CC BY-SA 2.0, so by law, people can remix it if they credit you. Using others' work without changing it even though it's credited is prohibited under CC BY-SA 2.0, so you MUST change it, a very little change is a big difference.

“I am not saying this against remixes, just that it seems unfair that ‘you can sell stuff as long as it’s not real money, but anyone can use it even without paying as long as they credit you’.” CC BY-SA requires items to be usable WITHOUT ANY SORT OF PAYMENT OR REQUIREMENT OTHER THAN A CHANGE IN THE WORK WITH NO REGARDS TO SIZE AND CREDIT TO THE ORIGINAL AUTHOR.

liamdadude

So there's ZERO verification therefore, people can scam others.

sti_scratch

liamdadude wrote:
So there's ZERO verification therefore, people can scam others.

A consequence for participating in non-ST-authorized currencies.

liamdadude

sti_scratch wrote:
liamdadude wrote:
So there's ZERO verification therefore, people can scam others.
A consequence for participating in non-ST-authorized currencies.

Ok I won't be getting into THAT mess

Aqua-Fox

I think this is a great idea uwu

katixirro

sti_scratch wrote:
katixirro wrote:
I don’t think this is fair. People are allowed to tell other people what to do with their work, to a certain extent of course, but still… We should be allowed to decide whether other people can use our work, it is ours after all, not Scratch’s.

There should be a rule that you have to ask another Scratcher to use their work, even if you give credit, unless it is a remix.

EDIT: I am not saying this against remixes, just that it seems unfair that “you can sell stuff as long as it’s not real money, but anyone can use it even without paying as long as they credit you”. That’s basically saying, “This shop can sell stuff, but people are allowed to steal from it as long as they say it was from that shop”. Do you get me?
All content published on Scratch is under CC BY-SA 2.0, so by law, people can remix it if they credit you. Using others' work without changing it even though it's credited is prohibited under CC BY-SA 2.0, so you MUST change it, a very little change is a big difference.

You don’t understand. There should be an option for what you want to license it under. Also, there was no need to be rude about it in the last part that I cut off. It’s my opinion and you can have yours.
A lot of people are too young to be on other websites, so they have to sell stuff here. Now they can’t even do that.
I am not changing my opinion on this, this is basically encouraging a new form of art theft. Plus, a lot of art on here is copyright on other websites, so therefore it cannot say it is licensed under this.

Riddle_Man

I agree.

So many people get upset if you take something without buying it and you give credit still, but you haven't bought it. It really annoys me (not that I do it, but people get banned from these point things for doing it).

EncloCreations

katixirro wrote:
sti_scratch wrote:
katixirro wrote:
I don’t think this is fair. People are allowed to tell other people what to do with their work, to a certain extent of course, but still… We should be allowed to decide whether other people can use our work, it is ours after all, not Scratch’s.

There should be a rule that you have to ask another Scratcher to use their work, even if you give credit, unless it is a remix.

EDIT: I am not saying this against remixes, just that it seems unfair that “you can sell stuff as long as it’s not real money, but anyone can use it even without paying as long as they credit you”. That’s basically saying, “This shop can sell stuff, but people are allowed to steal from it as long as they say it was from that shop”. Do you get me?
All content published on Scratch is under CC BY-SA 2.0, so by law, people can remix it if they credit you. Using others' work without changing it even though it's credited is prohibited under CC BY-SA 2.0, so you MUST change it, a very little change is a big difference.
You don’t understand. There should be an option for what you want to license it under. Also, there was no need to be rude about it in the last part that I cut off. It’s my opinion and you can have yours.
A lot of people are too young to be on other websites, so they have to sell stuff here. Now they can’t even do that.
I am not changing my opinion on this, this is basically encouraging a new form of art theft. Plus, a lot of art on here is copyright on other websites, so therefore it cannot say it is licensed under this.

I completley agree with this. There should be an option that allows you to choose the license for a project.

Bro342

dietbacon wrote:
Hi!

We wanted to make a post today to help provide some guidelines and clarify our policies around the use of points or virtual currencies to buy and sell sprites, art, or other things on Scratch. It’s great that people are using these to make new and creative projects for Scratch, but there are a few trends we see happening that could cause problems.

Some specific things we want to address are:
Participation in these point systems must be completely optional. You can create a studio with rules that you would like people to follow, but all of Scratch’s Community Guidelines still apply. For example, all projects on Scratch are remixable. If someone doesn’t give you ‘points’ for something, they can still remix, re-color, and share parts of those projects on Scratch as long as they follow the Community Guidelines.
It is not okay to say mean things, demand that Scratchers ‘pay’ if they have remixed or used something from your projects, or encourage others to post mean comments to someone because they didn’t participate in the point system.
Many of the projects being created require people to agree to some set of rules they must follow. Your project can include a list of rules, but it shouldn’t insist people do anything that doesn’t line up with our Community Guidelines.
Using something that feels like a real currency, such as creating a new crypto-currency for these studios, is not allowed on Scratch. Creating your own pretend point system that you keep track of in projects, comments, or studios is fine, but you should avoid doing anything that feels more like real money than this. Scratch isn’t meant for advertising or buying and selling things with real-world money.

If you have any questions or concerns about these rules, we encourage you to contact us about this.

Scratch on!

Hai,
I have some regards as I am creating a server that uses the Scratch API. All interaction will be on the Scratch website, projects and comments. However, is this allowed, because instant “transactions” would be a time saver (as I said, it will be all carried out by computers and servers on my side that check Cloud Data in projects and probably post on the users profile some sort of notice). As I do not want this to fall into number 4.
Thanks

Bro342

World_Languages wrote:
dietbacon wrote:
Participation in these point systems must be completely optional. You can create a studio with rules that you would like people to follow, but all of Scratch’s Community Guidelines still apply. For example, all projects on Scratch are remixable. If someone doesn’t give you ‘points’ for something, they can still remix, re-color, and share parts of those projects on Scratch as long as they follow the Community Guidelines.
It is not okay to say mean things, demand that Scratchers ‘pay’ if they have remixed or used something from your projects, or encourage others to post mean comments to someone because they didn’t participate in the point system.
Many of the projects being created require people to agree to some set of rules they must follow. Your project can include a list of rules, but it shouldn’t insist people do anything that doesn’t line up with our Community Guidelines.
Using something that feels like a real currency, such as creating a new crypto-currency for these studios, is not allowed on Scratch. Creating your own pretend point system that you keep track of in projects, comments, or studios is fine, but you should avoid doing anything that feels more like real money than this. Scratch isn’t meant for advertising or buying and selling things with real-world money.
Thank you for clarifying
Oh, and also:
5. Scratch “status” systems aren't allowed either.

What do you mean by status? Like rankings or systems that detect if a Scratcher is online, offline, away .etc?

rainbowpie14

Thank you for giving us these clarifications! Also, guys, please, if you don't agree with point currencies, then don't say “They're horrible and against the rules, don't do them!” This forum is to say they're okay as long as we agree with the guidelines.

when this post clicked
say [Please be respectful!]

liamdadude

EncloCreations wrote:
katixirro wrote:
sti_scratch wrote:
katixirro wrote:
I don’t think this is fair. People are allowed to tell other people what to do with their work, to a certain extent of course, but still… We should be allowed to decide whether other people can use our work, it is ours after all, not Scratch’s.

There should be a rule that you have to ask another Scratcher to use their work, even if you give credit, unless it is a remix.

EDIT: I am not saying this against remixes, just that it seems unfair that “you can sell stuff as long as it’s not real money, but anyone can use it even without paying as long as they credit you”. That’s basically saying, “This shop can sell stuff, but people are allowed to steal from it as long as they say it was from that shop”. Do you get me?
All content published on Scratch is under CC BY-SA 2.0, so by law, people can remix it if they credit you. Using others' work without changing it even though it's credited is prohibited under CC BY-SA 2.0, so you MUST change it, a very little change is a big difference.
You don’t understand. There should be an option for what you want to license it under. Also, there was no need to be rude about it in the last part that I cut off. It’s my opinion and you can have yours.
A lot of people are too young to be on other websites, so they have to sell stuff here. Now they can’t even do that.
I am not changing my opinion on this, this is basically encouraging a new form of art theft. Plus, a lot of art on here is copyright on other websites, so therefore it cannot say it is licensed under this.
I completley agree with this. There should be an option that allows you to choose the license for a project.

That would work fine, but it would be against the guidelines. The only way that might work is it the guidelines were different

sti_scratch

liamdadude wrote:
EncloCreations wrote:
katixirro wrote:
sti_scratch wrote:
katixirro wrote:
I don’t think this is fair. People are allowed to tell other people what to do with their work, to a certain extent of course, but still… We should be allowed to decide whether other people can use our work, it is ours after all, not Scratch’s.

There should be a rule that you have to ask another Scratcher to use their work, even if you give credit, unless it is a remix.

EDIT: I am not saying this against remixes, just that it seems unfair that “you can sell stuff as long as it’s not real money, but anyone can use it even without paying as long as they credit you”. That’s basically saying, “This shop can sell stuff, but people are allowed to steal from it as long as they say it was from that shop”. Do you get me?
All content published on Scratch is under CC BY-SA 2.0, so by law, people can remix it if they credit you. Using others' work without changing it even though it's credited is prohibited under CC BY-SA 2.0, so you MUST change it, a very little change is a big difference.
You don’t understand. There should be an option for what you want to license it under. Also, there was no need to be rude about it in the last part that I cut off. It’s my opinion and you can have yours.
A lot of people are too young to be on other websites, so they have to sell stuff here. Now they can’t even do that.
I am not changing my opinion on this, this is basically encouraging a new form of art theft. Plus, a lot of art on here is copyright on other websites, so therefore it cannot say it is licensed under this.
I completley agree with this. There should be an option that allows you to choose the license for a project.
That would work fine, but it would be against the guidelines. The only way that might work is it the guidelines were different

I am now trying my best to bring up my point without creating a heated debate; please acknowledge my effort.

An option for a different license is against Scratch's goal to promote children's imagination and creativity without monetary constraints presented to them. They can not build a country of lollipops in real life, so Scratch would like to respect their imagination and creativity by building this platform. The process of building up ideas from person to person is a beneficial thing to the community.

Many children are too young to be on other sites, that unfortunately is true. Though children younger than 13 can legally give out private information (for signing up) with parental consent according to COPPA, many sites prohibit them altogether to reduce the cost of verifying whether parental consent is given. The prioritization of money reduces children's chances, so suggesting Scratch to include an option for a license that enables monetization would make that problem be worse.

A lot of art here are from other websites, that unfortunately is true. The Scratch Team, as a matter of fact, would like to see those art reported to them when illegally published on Scratch (which most of them probably are, unfortunately).

Legally, if the author publishes art on Scratch, remixing with credit is not considered art theft. Though I must highlight this one more time, for those people who misunderstand and do not give credit, you must make a change and you must give credit in an obvious place.

In conclusion, Scratch would not like that system implemented as it is against their goal of promoting young children's great imagination. As liamthedude so rightly says, “it would be against the guidelines.” (implying Scratch Community Guidelines.)

Some people are not a fan of this system, this is true and I do not deny it. I would simply recommend them to find a different community where they would thrive better and meet their kind. Children not having other choices is not true - most Minecraft servers have an official economy, I would recommend Cubeville - but them having limited choices is true, because of the prioritization of money (and that supports the ST's (and my) point on the license and the currencies).

I hope it helps you understand, and thank you for reading.

- James

Last edited by sti_scratch (Feb. 17, 2019 04:33:01)

liamdadude

sti_scratch wrote:
liamdadude wrote:
EncloCreations wrote:
katixirro wrote:
sti_scratch wrote:
katixirro wrote:
I don’t think this is fair. People are allowed to tell other people what to do with their work, to a certain extent of course, but still… We should be allowed to decide whether other people can use our work, it is ours after all, not Scratch’s.

There should be a rule that you have to ask another Scratcher to use their work, even if you give credit, unless it is a remix.

EDIT: I am not saying this against remixes, just that it seems unfair that “you can sell stuff as long as it’s not real money, but anyone can use it even without paying as long as they credit you”. That’s basically saying, “This shop can sell stuff, but people are allowed to steal from it as long as they say it was from that shop”. Do you get me?
All content published on Scratch is under CC BY-SA 2.0, so by law, people can remix it if they credit you. Using others' work without changing it even though it's credited is prohibited under CC BY-SA 2.0, so you MUST change it, a very little change is a big difference.
You don’t understand. There should be an option for what you want to license it under. Also, there was no need to be rude about it in the last part that I cut off. It’s my opinion and you can have yours.
A lot of people are too young to be on other websites, so they have to sell stuff here. Now they can’t even do that.
I am not changing my opinion on this, this is basically encouraging a new form of art theft. Plus, a lot of art on here is copyright on other websites, so therefore it cannot say it is licensed under this.
I completley agree with this. There should be an option that allows you to choose the license for a project.
That would work fine, but it would be against the guidelines. The only way that might work is it the guidelines were different
There shouldn't be an option to choose what you want to license it under in order to follow Scratch's goal. Scratch is owned by MIT, and they decide what Scratch's goal is. If you don't want your content to be CC BY-SA, then don't use it on Scratch.

Exactly, a lot of people are too young to be on other sites, but that's not a reason to change Scratch's goal.

A lot of art here are from other websites, true, and you don't want that. Fact is, the ST doesn't want that either.

It's not a form of art theft, legally, if the art is published by the author on Scratch. Again, MIT made Scratch to be a sharing platform to help kids share their ideas and use others as a basis for theirs. Making you able to license it not under CC BY-SA makes Scratch not benefit the community much, and you know that's not what the MIT Media Lab Lifelong Kindergarten Group wants.

Thank you, but Scratch is not a place intended for making money, whether virtual or real. Scratch is to benefit the community, and if you want to make profit (whether with real or virtual money), there are places to do that. As liamthedude so rightly says, “it would be against the guidelines.”

I second that

Last edited by liamdadude (Feb. 17, 2019 04:36:26)

EncloCreations

Bro342 wrote:
dietbacon wrote:
Hi!

We wanted to make a post today to help provide some guidelines and clarify our policies around the use of points or virtual currencies to buy and sell sprites, art, or other things on Scratch. It’s great that people are using these to make new and creative projects for Scratch, but there are a few trends we see happening that could cause problems.

Some specific things we want to address are:
Participation in these point systems must be completely optional. You can create a studio with rules that you would like people to follow, but all of Scratch’s Community Guidelines still apply. For example, all projects on Scratch are remixable. If someone doesn’t give you ‘points’ for something, they can still remix, re-color, and share parts of those projects on Scratch as long as they follow the Community Guidelines.
It is not okay to say mean things, demand that Scratchers ‘pay’ if they have remixed or used something from your projects, or encourage others to post mean comments to someone because they didn’t participate in the point system.
Many of the projects being created require people to agree to some set of rules they must follow. Your project can include a list of rules, but it shouldn’t insist people do anything that doesn’t line up with our Community Guidelines.
Using something that feels like a real currency, such as creating a new crypto-currency for these studios, is not allowed on Scratch. Creating your own pretend point system that you keep track of in projects, comments, or studios is fine, but you should avoid doing anything that feels more like real money than this. Scratch isn’t meant for advertising or buying and selling things with real-world money.

If you have any questions or concerns about these rules, we encourage you to contact us about this.

Scratch on!

Hai,
I have some regards as I am creating a server that uses the Scratch API. All interaction will be on the Scratch website, projects and comments. However, is this allowed, because instant “transactions” would be a time saver (as I said, it will be all carried out by computers and servers on my side that check Cloud Data in projects and probably post on the users profile some sort of notice). As I do not want this to fall into number 4.
Thanks

Did you figure out the mattcoin api?

liamdadude

EncloCreations wrote:
Bro342 wrote:
dietbacon wrote:
Hi!

We wanted to make a post today to help provide some guidelines and clarify our policies around the use of points or virtual currencies to buy and sell sprites, art, or other things on Scratch. It’s great that people are using these to make new and creative projects for Scratch, but there are a few trends we see happening that could cause problems.

Some specific things we want to address are:
Participation in these point systems must be completely optional. You can create a studio with rules that you would like people to follow, but all of Scratch’s Community Guidelines still apply. For example, all projects on Scratch are remixable. If someone doesn’t give you ‘points’ for something, they can still remix, re-color, and share parts of those projects on Scratch as long as they follow the Community Guidelines.
It is not okay to say mean things, demand that Scratchers ‘pay’ if they have remixed or used something from your projects, or encourage others to post mean comments to someone because they didn’t participate in the point system.
Many of the projects being created require people to agree to some set of rules they must follow. Your project can include a list of rules, but it shouldn’t insist people do anything that doesn’t line up with our Community Guidelines.
Using something that feels like a real currency, such as creating a new crypto-currency for these studios, is not allowed on Scratch. Creating your own pretend point system that you keep track of in projects, comments, or studios is fine, but you should avoid doing anything that feels more like real money than this. Scratch isn’t meant for advertising or buying and selling things with real-world money.

If you have any questions or concerns about these rules, we encourage you to contact us about this.

Scratch on!

Hai,
I have some regards as I am creating a server that uses the Scratch API. All interaction will be on the Scratch website, projects and comments. However, is this allowed, because instant “transactions” would be a time saver (as I said, it will be all carried out by computers and servers on my side that check Cloud Data in projects and probably post on the users profile some sort of notice). As I do not want this to fall into number 4.
Thanks
Are reward systems allowed?

katixirro

sti_scratch wrote:
Children not having other choices is not true - most Minecraft servers have an official economy, I would recommend Cubeville - but them having limited choices is true, because of the prioritization of money (and that supports the ST's (and my) point on the license and the currencies).

I play Minecraft and Slither.io, but I want to join an artist community and talk to other artists and draw stuff. Sure, I can do pixel art on Minecraft, but it’s just not the same… I only have a few months until I turn 13 so I can leave then. A lot of artists on here have the same problem. It’s not the fact that I want to sell stuff, it’s the fact that other people are allowed to use my work. My only exception to that rule is a remix, but if it’s for their own project I’m against it unless they ask me first.

Dragonlord767

So, (just to clarify) is a “token” system where members of a shop collect tokens that can be exchanged for rewards allowed?

sti_scratch

Dragonlord767 wrote:
So, (just to clarify) is a “token” system where members of a shop collect tokens that can be exchanged for rewards allowed?

This thread is saying that all content on Scratch must be remixable, no matter whether it is part of an unofficial currency system. If the reward is art, other people who did not give you tokens for the art can still use art meant to be for another, though you may prohibit them from ordering art.

Last edited by sti_scratch (Feb. 17, 2019 20:50:07)

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