Hide Love and fave Counts for people who did not create the project

ChildCritic

ChocolatePi wrote:
You can't remove some aspect of Scratch just because it makes people “depressed”. What we need to do about depression is convince people to make better projects, not remove the thing that makes them depressed.

You can't force people to do better.

ChocolatePi wrote:
We should also remove the forums since they make people say things, which can make them, oh no, depressed!

It makes for conversation and debate, which is a great outweigh.

Last edited by ChildCritic (Jan. 13, 2016 00:35:14)

ChocolatePi

ChildCritic wrote:
ChocolatePi wrote:
You can't remove some aspect of Scratch just because it makes people “depressed”. What we need to do about depression is convince people to make better projects, not remove the thing that makes them depressed.
You can't make people do better.

That's kind of a low opinion of people you have there.

Scratch is a relatively easy-to-use tool, in my opinion, and it's easy to hop in and get started. With resources like the Wiki and the forums, you can't help but get better over time. It just takes time. And if you don't want to devote time to something, you can't expect to get better.

BookOwl

ChildCritic wrote:
Basically what's above. Scratch is not about fame.

This is the most overused phrase on the Suggestion forums. While I agree that Scratch's sole purpose is not fame, but there is nothing wrong with being famous, or knowing how many people like a project. I'll probably make a topic about this soon.
———————-

ChildCritic wrote:
If a scratcher were to look at someone's project and see a lot of loves, he would either be motivated, or depressed (irony!)

Why would people get depressed because somebody's project got a lot of loves?
———————-

ChildCritic wrote:
We do not need people leaving Scratch because they are not famous.

If they are the kind of people that would do that, Scratch just isn't for them.
Also, this does nothing to fix the root cause of the problem. From what I've seen, the people that ask questions like “why are my projects not popular?” are not asking that because they saw a project that has lot's of views. It's because they aren't getting many views. In my opinion, we should be encouraging the people that don't have as many loves by giving them more chances to be viewed, and not removing something that doesn't have anything to do with the root cause.
———————-

ChildCritic wrote:
Disclaimer: This does not affect the “Remixes” section on the project page.
Disclaimer 2: This does not delete the “What the community is loving” section on the home page, just removes the love count.

Nothing to say.
———————-
tl;dr
There is nothing wrong with people knowing how many loves and favs a project has. We should be focusing on helping unpopular Scratchers get the opportunity to get views, loves, and favorites.
No Support

Dy155

Support!

IronBit_Studios

No support as per ChocolatePi and Zro716

PrincessPanda_test_

IronBit_Studios wrote:
No support as per ChocolatePi and Zro716

PikaPal54

No support. How are you able to know how good a project is without just mindlessly clicking on random projects, hoping you find a good one? Also,

IronBit_Studios wrote:
No support as per ChocolatePi and Zro716

Sheep_tester

PikaPal54 wrote:
No support. How are you able to know how good a project is without just mindlessly clicking on random projects, hoping you find a good one? Also,
IronBit_Studios wrote:
No support as per ChocolatePi and Zro716

You do not simply judge a project by its numbers. You judge a project by its content.

btw support, though because I like statistics, this link should still return the number of loves and favorites as a hidden feature.

PikaPal54

Sheep_tester wrote:
PikaPal54 wrote:
No support. How are you able to know how good a project is without just mindlessly clicking on random projects, hoping you find a good one? Also,
IronBit_Studios wrote:
No support as per ChocolatePi and Zro716
You do not simply judge a project by its numbers. You judge a project by its content.

I'm not saying that just because it has lots of likes and favorites, it's automatically a good project. What I meant is you wouldn't be able to see the opinions of others if this was implemented.

Sheep_tester

PikaPal54 wrote:
Sheep_tester wrote:
PikaPal54 wrote:
No support. How are you able to know how good a project is without just mindlessly clicking on random projects, hoping you find a good one? Also,
IronBit_Studios wrote:
No support as per ChocolatePi and Zro716
You do not simply judge a project by its numbers. You judge a project by its content.
I'm not saying that just because it has lots of likes and favorites, it's automatically a good project. What I meant is you wouldn't be able to see the opinions of others if this was implemented.

1) or it could be a project that claims to be a social experiment and does nothing except for asking for loves
2) opinions are comments are should be conveniently stored in the comments section

Roaring_Inferno

BookOwl wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
Basically what's above. Scratch is not about fame.
This is the most overused phrase on the Suggestion forums. While I agree that Scratch's sole purpose is not fame, but there is nothing wrong with being famous, or knowing how many people like a project. I'll probably make a topic about this soon.
———————-
ChildCritic wrote:
If a scratcher were to look at someone's project and see a lot of loves, he would either be motivated, or depressed (irony!)
Why would people get depressed because somebody's project got a lot of loves?
———————-
ChildCritic wrote:
We do not need people leaving Scratch because they are not famous.
If they are the kind of people that would do that, Scratch just isn't for them.
Also, this does nothing to fix the root cause of the problem. From what I've seen, the people that ask questions like “why are my projects not popular?” are not asking that because they saw a project that has lot's of views. It's because they aren't getting many views. In my opinion, we should be encouraging the people that don't have as many loves by giving them more chances to be viewed, and not removing something that doesn't have anything to do with the root cause.
———————-
ChildCritic wrote:
Disclaimer: This does not affect the “Remixes” section on the project page.
Disclaimer 2: This does not delete the “What the community is loving” section on the home page, just removes the love count.
Nothing to say.
———————-
tl;dr
There is nothing wrong with people knowing how many loves and favs a project has. We should be focusing on helping unpopular Scratchers get the opportunity to get views, loves, and favorites.
No Support

No Support as per BookOwl.

ChildCritic

ChocolatePi wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
ChocolatePi wrote:
You can't remove some aspect of Scratch just because it makes people “depressed”. What we need to do about depression is convince people to make better projects, not remove the thing that makes them depressed.
You can't force people to do better.
That's kind of a low opinion of people you have there.

Scratch is a relatively easy-to-use tool, in my opinion, and it's easy to hop in and get started. With resources like the Wiki and the forums, you can't help but get better over time. It just takes time. And if you don't want to devote time to something, you can't expect to get better.

Corrected post.

BookOwl wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
Basically what's above. Scratch is not about fame.
This is the most overused phrase on the Suggestion forums. While I agree that Scratch's sole purpose is not fame, but there is nothing wrong with being famous, or knowing how many people like a project. I'll probably make a topic about this soon.

What's not the matter? It is a number that does not mean anything in terms of how you will like it. It is a number that can get unreasonably high. It's a number that is the first thing you see after the project. It has nothing to do with you. There is no point in seeing it.

BookOwl wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
If a scratcher were to look at someone's project and see a lot of loves, he would either be motivated, or depressed (irony!)
Why would people get depressed because somebody's project got a lot of loves?

Because they can't get that number.

BookOwl wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
We do not need people leaving Scratch because they are not famous.
If they are the kind of people that would do that, Scratch just isn't for them.
Also, this does nothing to fix the root cause of the problem. From what I've seen, the people that ask questions like “why are my projects not popular?” are not asking that because they saw a project that has lot's of views. It's because they aren't getting many views. In my opinion, we should be encouraging the people that don't have as many loves by giving them more chances to be viewed, and not removing something that doesn't have anything to do with the root cause.

I'm deleting the benchmark here, so that people think “Wow! 3 Loves!” and not “Darn, this project has 20,000 loves and I only have 3.”
<offtopic>

BookOwl wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
Disclaimer: This does not affect the “Remixes” section on the project page.
Disclaimer 2: This does not delete the “What the community is loving” section on the home page, just removes the love count.
Nothing to say.

Then why'd you say you did not have anything to say?
</offtopic>

ChocolatePi wrote:
I said that post that I made above to make a point. People use the cliche phrase “Scratch is not about fame” to justify just about anything they think up, which is not to say this is a bad idea. It just needs work. Maybe display love counts like “100+” or “1000+”?

I knew you were trying to make a point and I was having a little fun with it.

Vienradze wrote:
Sorry, I don't agree. Do you want know why?

As an edit to your original post, yes.

Zro716 wrote:
I lose a little faith in the forum community every time someone plays the “Scratch is not about fame” card. It's been so overused and hardly has merit anymore. Instead of clinching to a vague argument, let's actually think about the pros and cons of a suggestion, please.

Let's understand that this suggestion has 1 con, and 2 of good things about it.

PROS:
No more “100th love!” spam.
No more benchmark for non famous people.

CONS:
Immense confusion
I can't balance the field

Zro716 wrote:
From my perspective, there is no real problem caused by the love/fave counts aside from minor spam like “100th love!”. But then, if no one except the creator could see how many loves and faves a project had, a lot of comments would probably be like “why is this top loved? It has no love its! I'm confused?????” and it would take a lot of explaining about their removal (look back at how long it took to tell everyone about the restrictions on FNAF).

What's not the matter? It is a number that does not mean anything in terms of how you will like it. It is a number that can get unreasonably high. It's a number that is the first thing you see after the project. It has nothing to do with you. There is no point in seeing it.
That was because so many FNAF fans were yelling at it, and not reading the original post.

Zro716 wrote:
Back when the ST removed the follower/following counts, I had mixed feelings. Sometimes I was happy to see them removed for eliminating people's follower cravings, but other times I was annoyed that the update did not do justice. For instance, it didn't remove the follower count on the follower webpage which was easily accessible. What perplexed me the most about that update was the removal of the comment count - nowadays I'm having difficulty judging how many comments I have on my profile to know when to clean up.

This isn't going to go through that much pain.

Zro716 wrote:
It's not a surprise some folks feel that anything fame-related means it generates bad feelings for some. Well what do you expect, a trophy for participation? People are gonna feel bad because they set their expectations too high, and they can't live up to it. That makes our mission more about leveraging expectations than exempting everyone from recognition.

This suggestion is designed to remove the mark to hit, so that people don't feel bad when they don't reach expectations.

Zro716 wrote:
Now onto the topic at hand: would hiding loves and faves from others really solve this issue, or is there something else we can do? In my opinion, hiding stuff doesn't work. It just annoys people. It makes them work a little harder to know what was hidden. Can you imagine my stress when I have to reply to a dozen or so people every day asking “how many loves does this have now”? In this sense, it is better to have the stats public.

I already answered that.

Last edited by ChildCritic (Jan. 13, 2016 22:56:53)

ChocolatePi

ChildCritic wrote:
ChocolatePi wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
If a scratcher were to look at someone's project and see a lot of loves, he would either be motivated, or depressed (irony!)
Why would people get depressed because somebody's project got a lot of loves?
Because they can't get that number.
ChocolatePi wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
We do not need people leaving Scratch because they are not famous.
If they are the kind of people that would do that, Scratch just isn't for them.
Also, this does nothing to fix the root cause of the problem. From what I've seen, the people that ask questions like “why are my projects not popular?” are not asking that because they saw a project that has lot's of views. It's because they aren't getting many views. In my opinion, we should be encouraging the people that don't have as many loves by giving them more chances to be viewed, and not removing something that doesn't have anything to do with the root cause.
I'm deleting the benchmark here, so that people think “Wow! 3 Loves!” and not “Darn, this project has 20,000 loves and I only have 3.”
<offtopic>
ChocolatePi wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
Disclaimer: This does not affect the “Remixes” section on the project page.
Disclaimer 2: This does not delete the “What the community is loving” section on the home page, just removes the love count.
Nothing to say.
Then why'd you say you did not have anything to say?

I never said those things.

ChocolatePi

I get your point about people getting depressed - although those are most likely the people that want to make something great, with no effort. I don't think we should take away a helpful statistic from those who earned it all because of a few people who don't want to earn it.

BookOwl

ChocolatePi wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
ChocolatePi wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
If a scratcher were to look at someone's project and see a lot of loves, he would either be motivated, or depressed (irony!)
Why would people get depressed because somebody's project got a lot of loves?
Because they can't get that number.
ChocolatePi wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
We do not need people leaving Scratch because they are not famous.
If they are the kind of people that would do that, Scratch just isn't for them.
Also, this does nothing to fix the root cause of the problem. From what I've seen, the people that ask questions like “why are my projects not popular?” are not asking that because they saw a project that has lot's of views. It's because they aren't getting many views. In my opinion, we should be encouraging the people that don't have as many loves by giving them more chances to be viewed, and not removing something that doesn't have anything to do with the root cause.
I'm deleting the benchmark here, so that people think “Wow! 3 Loves!” and not “Darn, this project has 20,000 loves and I only have 3.”
<offtopic>
ChocolatePi wrote:
ChildCritic wrote:
Disclaimer: This does not affect the “Remixes” section on the project page.
Disclaimer 2: This does not delete the “What the community is loving” section on the home page, just removes the love count.
Nothing to say.
Then why'd you say you did not have anything to say?
I never said those things.

Hi there, I'm ChocolatePi!

VoltageGames

also please learn what depression is.

8 year olds don't get depressed by seeing someone make a better project than them.
I think the word you're looking for is ‘sad.’
they get ‘sad’ because 8 year olds overreact to everything and there is nothing you can do to please them.

AwesomeSmilee

No support.
Scratch may not be about fame, but fame's still good. Oh, and barely anyone would want to quit because they saw a project with a ton of loves or favourites. I mean, a new Scratcher would understand that they've just joined and can't expect that they'll instantly get a million loves and faves.

udoxas

No support. Have you seen someone leave Scratch because they looked at the loves and favorites of a project? Probably not. It just seems like a weird scenario.

Gaza101

No support. I understand your reasoning but, if Scratch isn't about fame, why would people feel depressed about the love and favourite counts anyway?

DaSpudLord

Okay, while I still no support this topic, there is one thing I need to say-

Gaza101 wrote:
if Scratch isn't about fame, why would people feel depressed about the love and favourite counts anyway?

If beaches aren't for shark attacks, then why do people get attacked by sharks?

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