Discuss Scratch

harry1o7
Scratcher
30 posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

My idea: When you upload an image, it should appear in vector instead of bitmap.
I think this is a very important feature. When you upload an image into scratch, it defaults to bitmap. This would be fine with most pictures, but bitmap relies on a pixel grid to form images, and high-res images are scaled down to fit in that grid. Plus, when it is scaled down, it doesn't do it very well. Pixels are often out of position, and they end up looking really weird.
I know this would work, technically, because bitmap things and images that are converted to vector are just rendered as a single shape. This could be the default case in vector, rendered at full definition as one shape. The only reason for it to be in bitmap is to edit it, and then you could just switch and have what happens by default now happen then.
I want this cuz I want to have actual high res pictures instead of pixels.
If you have any questions or just want to support, please comment. Thanks!

Edit: Basic grammar, apparently I missed second grade

Last edited by harry1o7 (Jan. 26, 2021 19:27:35)

the2000
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

Support, though I don't want smaller images to be scaled up, I only want big images to be scaled down. I've had to deal with the pixel size thing in the past and it's really annoying.
bobcat0701
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

support today I shared two projects and had to take them down to convert the images to vector
harry1o7
Scratcher
30 posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

Well nothing would get a better resolution, it would just keep its resolution and not lose it.
the2000
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

bobcat0701 wrote:

support today I shared two projects and had to take them down to convert the images to vector
Converting them to vector won't do anything once they've already been converted to bitmap.
bobcat0701
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

the2000 wrote:

bobcat0701 wrote:

support today I shared two projects and had to take them down to convert the images to vector
Converting them to vector won't do anything once they've already been converted to bitmap.
no it worked
the2000
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

bobcat0701 wrote:

the2000 wrote:

bobcat0701 wrote:

support today I shared two projects and had to take them down to convert the images to vector
Converting them to vector won't do anything once they've already been converted to bitmap.
no it worked
Really? Show proof. That's physically impossible unless you used external tools.
mlcreater
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

I don't think it would make sense to upload a bitmap image and have it appear in vector. Some people prefer bitmap mode.
-db
Scratcher
500+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

Can you change the title to Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap Option. As mlcreater said “Some people prefer bitmap mode.” This would not make some of the people who prefer bitmap happy because they have to stay on vector. I'd recommend that it would be an option in the Account Settings.
Zoomer_X
Scratcher
500+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

Most images, like ones on Google, are either JPG, JPEG, or PNG images. But you need to get a (vector) SVG image. It is also “impossible” to convert one of those images to a SVG because once an image is bitmap, it stays bitmap, even if you “convert it to vector”.
Wow I wrote this a long time ago…
Flowermanvista
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

the2000 wrote:

bobcat0701 wrote:

the2000 wrote:

bobcat0701 wrote:

support today I shared two projects and had to take them down to convert the images to vector
Converting them to vector won't do anything once they've already been converted to bitmap.
no it worked
Really? Show proof. That's physically impossible unless you used external tools.
I've seen all sorts of people saying that converting bitmap images to vector makes them look better, even though, in theory, that doesn't actually do anything - I can only assume it's due to some quirk in Scratch's renderer (although I can't see a difference).

(Also, you shouldn't just say “that's impossible”, you should also explain why. Just my 2 cents, though.)
harry1o7
Scratcher
30 posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

-db wrote:

Can you change the title to Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap Option. As mlcreater said “Some people prefer bitmap mode.” This would not make some of the people who prefer bitmap happy because they have to stay on vector. I'd recommend that it would be an option in the Account Settings.
I mean you could just switch them. It wouldn't result in anything different then the default setting now.
gosoccerboy5
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

the2000 wrote:

bobcat0701 wrote:

the2000 wrote:

Converting them to vector won't do anything once they've already been converted to bitmap.
no it worked
Really? Show proof. That's physically impossible unless you used external tools.
Ah yes pixels lighting up in a certain manner are physical beings

No support. Bitmap is bitmap and it makes no sense to upload a bitmap image and find it in vector.
the2000
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

gosoccerboy5 wrote:

the2000 wrote:

bobcat0701 wrote:

the2000 wrote:

Converting them to vector won't do anything once they've already been converted to bitmap.
no it worked
Really? Show proof. That's physically impossible unless you used external tools.
Ah yes pixels lighting up in a certain manner are physical beings
Okay fine, if your screen got broken in such a way. that it happens to display the images at a higher resolution, then sure. Physically unlikely. Also yes computer monitors do exist physically
-EmeraldThunder-
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

The images uploaded mostly all have bitmap file extensions.
lovecodeabc
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

just use .svg's
the2000
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

lovecodeabc wrote:

just use .svg's
It's annoying to have to go through a third-party program to make a raster image into a vector object just to prevent it from being smushed when you import it.
Flowermanvista
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

the2000 wrote:

gosoccerboy5 wrote:

the2000 wrote:

bobcat0701 wrote:

the2000 wrote:

Converting them to vector won't do anything once they've already been converted to bitmap.
no it worked
Really? Show proof. That's physically impossible unless you used external tools.
Ah yes pixels lighting up in a certain manner are physical beings
Okay fine, if your screen got broken in such a way. that it happens to display the images at a higher resolution, then sure. Physically unlikely. Also yes computer monitors do exist physically
You've still failed to explain exactly what is impossible or how it is impossible, and as evidenced by @gosoccerboy5's response, people are not getting your point as a result.

For everyone else reading this thread, this is roughly what @the2000 is getting at (it's long, but it's required reading in order to be able to understand the point being made):
The two image formats that Scratch has, bitmap and vector, work in substantially different ways. Bitmap images consist of an array of pixels with a definite size, while vector images consist of instructions defining how to draw lines, curves, text, and other such things. As you might expect, vector images can be resized infinitely without issue, while bitmap images will either get pixelated or blurry (depending on the upscaling method used) when upscaled any more than 100% size - since to do so would require conjuring more pixels out of nowhere through…magic, I guess? (Or AI?)

The point is that, in theory, converting a bitmap image to vector should not result in any visible difference, as we've already established that you can't just magically get more detail out a bitmap image - and indeed, when you do so, the bitmap image just gets embedded in the SVG file.

In practice, however, I do believe that due to a quirk in Scratch's rendering engine, doing this does actually make bitmap images look a little better. The difference was too small for me to note in my first post on this topic, but I imported a high resolution (1280x720) bitmap image and converted it to vector - while it was still pixelated, it was a little softer-looking, so I guess it looks slightly better? I don't get what all the fuss is, but whatevs.

With all this in mind, I'm proposing that the suggestion be changed from “having all uploaded images being in vector by default” to “fix whatever rendering quirk that makes converting bitmap images to vector cause them to look better, so they look equally good in both modes”. I didn't read the OP, see the next two posts.

Last edited by Flowermanvista (Jan. 27, 2021 14:12:16)

the2000
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

Flowermanvista wrote:

With all this in mind, I'm proposing that the suggestion be changed from “having all uploaded images being in vector by default” to “fix whatever rendering quirk that makes converting bitmap images to vector cause them to look better, so they look equally good in both modes”.
I don't think that's why they made this suggestion initially. I would recommend that you make a separate thread for that
Flowermanvista
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Uploaded Images Should Start in Vector, not Bitmap

the2000 wrote:

Flowermanvista wrote:

With all this in mind, I'm proposing that the suggestion be changed from “having all uploaded images being in vector by default” to “fix whatever rendering quirk that makes converting bitmap images to vector cause them to look better, so they look equally good in both modes”.
I don't think that's why they made this suggestion initially. I would recommend that you make a separate thread for that
After reading the OP (which, like a dolt, I didn't), I think you're right.

However, I believe that what I was talking about is the reason why @bobcat0701 supported this.

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